{"comments":{"848640":{"pb_id":"1111","pb_type":"members","likes":"0","parent_id":"0","pid":"848640","comment_id":"848640","member_id":"1111","comment":"

<\/a>Dave Ross, on , said:<\/p>

\nI had vowed before to never run any of the Rock and Roll events due to their outrageous entry fees,but this only reinforces that decision. What are they really "giving back" to the sport? Are they going to reduce their entry fees based on the money that they'll save?
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\nDave, that would be a wonderful idea, but we know that won't happen. I think it's time for fans to start distinguishing what the SPORT is and what the ACTIVITY of running is. Scott Dickey said it himself, they are in it for the recreational, back of the pack, runner. That's where their business focuses its attention. They support the ACTIVITY of distance running, not the sport. It's time for the SPORT to stand up and start defining itself.","date_added":"Sep 3rd 2013, 5:57pm","nest":0,"liked":false,"member":[],"can_delete":false,"item_id":172047,"item_type":"news","pb_image":"\/\/www.runnerspace.com\/forum\/uploads\/av-1111.jpg","pb_title":"Scott Bush","pb_url":"profile.php?member_id=1111","pb_url_dns":"https:\/\/Scott-Bush.runnerspace.com\/","pb_wally_id":"624"},"847921":{"pb_id":"43662","pb_type":"members","likes":"0","parent_id":"0","pid":"847921","comment_id":"847921","member_id":"43662","comment":"I had vowed before to never run any of the Rock and Roll events due to their outrageous entry fees,but this only reinforces that decision. What are they really "giving back" to the sport? Are they going to reduce their entry fees based on the money that they'll save?","date_added":"Sep 3rd 2013, 6:01am","nest":0,"liked":false,"member":[],"can_delete":false,"item_id":172047,"item_type":"news","pb_image":"\/\/www.runnerspace.com\/forum\/uploads\/av-43662.jpg","pb_title":"Dave Ross","pb_url":"profile.php?member_id=43662","pb_url_dns":"https:\/\/Dave-Ross.runnerspace.com\/","pb_wally_id":"1073377"},"846802":{"pb_id":"1111","pb_type":"members","likes":"0","parent_id":"0","pid":"846802","comment_id":"846802","member_id":"1111","comment":"Scott Dickey, head of CGI, got on Toni Reavis' and commented. I'll share more thoughts on this soon, just wanted to get this out there:
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\n
http:\/\/tonireavis.co...cing\/#more-8038<\/a>
\n
\nToni, after reading your post I thought it might be best that I reply publicly to clear the air a bit. Let me start by reinforcing my respect for you and all you have done for the sport. There are very few individuals that have dedicated so much energy, passion and hours to the sport of running like you Toni, and for that we all owe you a huge debt of gratitude.
\n
\nI was somewhat surprised to read your post today especially after yesterday\u0092s public quote in the Runner\u0092s World? For those that didn\u0092t have a chance to read that piece Toni\u0092s quote started with: \u0093I don\u0092t blame them,\u0094 Reavis told Runner\u0092s World Newswire. For the full quote and story, here\u0092s the link.
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http:\/\/www.runnerswo...s-elite-program<\/a>
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\nI don\u0092t fault you for reviewing our decision and for changing your mind after further reflection. But I do want to clear up a few things.
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\n\u0093Poof\u0094 as you put it when referring to the overnight decision is a tad inaccurate. Our decision to no longer pay appearance fees for Elites in our North American RnR events was a difficult one to say the least. This is not a \u0091practical end\u0092 of our support of the sport, but it was a clear strategic acknowledgement of investing in elements that impact all 500,000 runners at RnR events not just the 50 or so at the front of the pack.
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\nCompetitor Group is at it\u0092s core a health and wellness company dedicated to promoting and enhancing an active lifestyle. Lifestyle is the key word, not Sport. Rock n Roll marathons have always been about the journey, the commitment, the personal dedication required to train and finish a half or full marathon. We\u0092re not about how fast you complete the race, we\u0092re about the fact that you showed up on the start line and the commitment one has made to complete the journey.
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\nWe will always celebrate the achievements of the greatest athletes in the Sport and hold them up as inspiration for all of us to enjoy. We will do this through our media assets like Competitor mag, Competitor.com, Triathlete mag, Triathlete.com, Women\u0092s Running mag, Women\u0092s Running.com. We have more staff dedicated to reporting on the Sport than any company in the world other than Rodale. With regard to RnR, we will always welcome the elites, we are just not going to spend in excess of 7-figures annually to simply have them show up. It represents a disconnect from the brand and the very promise of participating in a RnR event. We\u0092re going to reinvest those dollars into entertainment, the experience, more staff to execute more flawlessly, and in our continued efforts to increase participation.
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\nWhile we are the largest series in the world, we\u0092re not the only ones who have taken this position. Of the 5 top marketshare properties in the U.S. (Competitor, Disney, NYRR, US Road Sports and Nike), only one of them, NYRR, has a significant investment in Elite Athletes at their races. So while our decision may disappoint, it certainly is not without precedent.
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\nWith regard to TV component of your post, I want to remind you that it wasn\u0092t until last year that NYRR and Mary were able to secure a national broadcast deal with ESPN after so many years of having a local ABC time buy. As you know, the media landscape has changed dramatically in the past five years, and while we continue to seek broadcast partners on a market by market basis (KLAS in Vegas, WRAL in Raleigh, etc), the ability to sell advertising in support of such broadcasts is difficult to say the least and a much more complicated process than the picture you are painting. I know you understand this intimately.
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\nWhile I understand that financial investors are always an easy target, I find the whole private equity discussion somewhat naive. You don\u0092t have to look very far for great analogies to understand that increased public and private investment into a Sport can lead to tremendous growth for all. Private equity investment strategy is all about growth. You don\u0092t cut your way to growth. Our decision to reinvest in other areas of the experience is a strategic decision and not one that we take lightly for a moment. You don\u0092t have to look far, maybe start with the annual Running USA participation studies, to confirm the facts about RnR\u0092s contributions to the sport and the growth of the industry. We have taken more risk, invested more dollars than anyone in the history of the industry and whether it is the highest percentage of female participation in the industry or the highest percentage of first timers joining the fun, I\u0092m not sure it is valid to question our dedication or commitment to promoting running and growing participation.
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\nAnd by the way, let\u0092s not forget that almost all of the industry\u0092s dominate players operate as public equity or private equity operations: Active, Disney, Nike, Lifetime, World Triathlon Corp and Competitor. WIth outside investment industries grow, innovate and become more sophisticated. I don\u0092t think Competitor needs to apologize or hide from this basic fundamental premise.
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\nWith much respect,
\n
\nScott Dickey
\nPresident\/CEO
\nCompetitor Group","date_added":"Sep 2nd 2013, 1:11pm","nest":0,"liked":false,"member":[],"can_delete":false,"item_id":172047,"item_type":"news","pb_image":"\/\/www.runnerspace.com\/forum\/uploads\/av-1111.jpg","pb_title":"Scott Bush","pb_url":"profile.php?member_id=1111","pb_url_dns":"https:\/\/Scott-Bush.runnerspace.com\/","pb_wally_id":"624"},"846700":{"pb_id":"9184","pb_type":"members","likes":"0","parent_id":"0","pid":"846700","comment_id":"846700","member_id":"9184","comment":"

<\/a>Scott Bush, on , said:<\/p>

\nDan, my thought with this is that CGI has all the sponsorship power and veto power in this type of arrangement.<\/div><\/div>
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\nNot if there's a clearly written arrangement where the two events have nothing to do with each other beyond the shared course and course setup\/staffing. That should be pretty straight forward.
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\n

Quote<\/p>

They clearly believe there is very little value in having pros affiliated with their events, so why would they front the set up costs?<\/div><\/div>
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\nI don't think that's true at all. I believe they know there is value, just not enough to warrant the cost. Take away the cost and whatever value there is is a net positive.
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\n

Quote<\/p>

Further, a new group supporting the the sport of road racing needs revenue avenues.<\/div><\/div>
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\nEliminating known (and significant) costs is a better starting point than hoping for elusive revenue streams.
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\nDan","date_added":"Sep 2nd 2013, 5:21am","nest":0,"liked":false,"member":[],"can_delete":false,"item_id":172047,"item_type":"news","pb_image":"members\/avatar\/3295.jpg","pb_title":"dkap","pb_url":"profile.php?member_id=9184","pb_url_dns":"https:\/\/dkap.runnerspace.com\/","pb_wally_id":"10044"},"846680":{"pb_id":"3026","pb_type":"members","likes":"0","parent_id":"0","pid":"846680","comment_id":"846680","member_id":"3026","comment":"I, too, thought that the move made sense at a pure financial level. What are most elites bringing to races that is of value these days? Yes, some do the expo deal and meet with fans but most do not.
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\nToni Reavis had a great blog today. It's well worth a read.
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http:\/\/tonireavis.co...cing\/#more-8038<\/a>
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\nAfter reading it, I'm not wondering what kind of trickle down effects the decision will have.","date_added":"Sep 2nd 2013, 2:29am","nest":0,"liked":false,"member":{"wally_id":"35","email_settings":"7168","email":"chrisnickinson@gmail.com","address":"chrisnickinson","gender":"m","member_id":"3026","member_name":"Chris Nickinson","avatar_location":"av-3026.jpg","avatar_type":"upload","avatar":"\/\/www.runnerspace.com\/forum\/uploads\/av-3026.jpg"},"can_delete":false,"item_id":172047,"item_type":"news","pb_image":"\/\/www.runnerspace.com\/forum\/uploads\/av-3026.jpg","pb_title":"Chris Nickinson","pb_url":"profile.php?member_id=3026","pb_url_dns":"https:\/\/chrisnickinson.runnerspace.com\/","pb_wally_id":"35"},"846666":{"pb_id":"1111","pb_type":"members","likes":"0","parent_id":"0","pid":"846666","comment_id":"846666","member_id":"1111","comment":"

<\/a>dkap, on , said:<\/p>

\nThe only challenge is coming up with an agreement in writing that's strong enough to where the two sides aren't constantly fighting over who gets what. I don't think that would be too tough, though, as there really wouldn't be any money in the equation, and that's all people usually fight over.
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\nSure, in a perfect world we'd have the elite side of the sport all by itself for better media attention, but I think I would rather keep the two lumped together and redirect the thousands of setup dollars to the athletes.
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\nDan, my thought with this is that CGI has all the sponsorship power and veto power in this type of arrangement. They clearly believe there is very little value in having pros affiliated with their events, so why would they front the set up costs? Further, a new group supporting the the sport of road racing needs revenue avenues. Sponsorships, media and marketing value are the only way to build up a revenue stream, especially at first, but that becomes impossible if the organization partners with CGI, NYRR, etc., because of their already vested interests.
\n
\nStarting from scratch and reinventing the sport is obviously challenging, time consuming and a huge risk, however, it's been done before in other sports and it can be done again, this time in our sport. Will anyone ever jump up to the plate? That's the real question.
\n
\nOne last note...would it be such a bad thing if appearance money disappeared from our sport? Outside of the very top-end runners, very few get anything worth noting. How many other sports act this way? Does Roger Federer get paid an appearance fee to go play at the U.S. Open? Does Tiger Woods get an appearance fee for playing at the Masters? Why should ANY pro runner get paid an appearance fee? Where's the value? Where's the ROI? Bigger prize purses increases interest and exposure...plus a series could make that public. Few know how much Meb gets paid to run NYRR races. However, putting $250k out there that athletes are running for...that's worth talking about and general sports fans might actually take notice. Again, I digress...","date_added":"Sep 2nd 2013, 1:10am","nest":0,"liked":false,"member":[],"can_delete":false,"item_id":172047,"item_type":"news","pb_image":"\/\/www.runnerspace.com\/forum\/uploads\/av-1111.jpg","pb_title":"Scott Bush","pb_url":"profile.php?member_id=1111","pb_url_dns":"https:\/\/Scott-Bush.runnerspace.com\/","pb_wally_id":"624"},"846661":{"pb_id":"9184","pb_type":"members","likes":"0","parent_id":"0","pid":"846661","comment_id":"846661","member_id":"9184","comment":"I wonder if there isn't a good middle ground here, staring us in the face? Scott's post got me thinking...
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\nLet's say some new entity comes along to actively support elite road racing. Not only do they need to come up with appearance\/price money, but they also face the reasonably big cost of putting on the races. The longer the race, the more expensive that gets. (Track and XC lack such an aspect, as far as I can think.)
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\nHowever, if such a group were to "partner" with CGI, everyone could come out a winner. CGI puts on the races just like they would sans elites, while the new group handles all the elite details. They're just a tiny add-on at the front of the pack, as far as the thousands of runners are concerned... Pretty much of no consequence. And CGI can still promote the elites in the field and gain the positive p.r. of not having dropped them.
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\nThe only challenge is coming up with an agreement in writing that's strong enough to where the two sides aren't constantly fighting over who gets what. I don't think that would be too tough, though, as there really wouldn't be any money in the equation, and that's all people usually fight over.
\n
\nSure, in a perfect world we'd have the elite side of the sport all by itself for better media attention, but I think I would rather keep the two lumped together and redirect the thousands of setup dollars to the athletes.
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\nDan","date_added":"Sep 2nd 2013, 12:03am","nest":0,"liked":false,"member":[],"can_delete":false,"item_id":172047,"item_type":"news","pb_image":"members\/avatar\/3295.jpg","pb_title":"dkap","pb_url":"profile.php?member_id=9184","pb_url_dns":"https:\/\/dkap.runnerspace.com\/","pb_wally_id":"10044"},"846652":{"pb_id":"1111","pb_type":"members","likes":"0","parent_id":"0","pid":"846652","comment_id":"846652","member_id":"1111","comment":"I agree with both Dan and Matt and have to say that I view CGI's move as a good thing. Yes, athletes, especially those already committed to Philadelphia, are taking a financial blow, which is both ridiculous and totally unethical, however, I see this as a chance to redefine the sport. The SPORT of road racing started to fade in stature rapidly during this latest running boom (beginning in the late-90's). As road running became a big business opportunity, the SPORT faded and the ACTIVITY thrived.
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\nIn all honesty, now is the time for the right entities to step up and create a pro road racing circuit in the U.S., separating the pros from everyone else. Meb, Ritz, Deena, Desi, Hartmann, Abdi, Teg...these athletes are nothing like the 99.99% of other runners who take part (not necessarily compete) in the same events. It's like putting LeBron, Kobe, DRose, etc., in an all-comers tournament and calling it a sport. It's like sticking me and 10,000 other people who can't swim all that great in the pool with Michael Phelps. He'd lap everyone a million times and I honestly wouldn't care because I'd just be splashing around having a good time with my friends. Same goes for putting me in the same tournament as Tiger Woods. He'd shoot 40 strokes better than me, but I wouldn't care because I'd be having fun with my friends, wouldn't see him playing and would only focus on my game rather than his performance.
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\nRACING IS DIFFERENT THAN RUNNING. The vast majority of people who run road races are running them. The 10-20% who are constantly pushing themselves, like most of us on these boards, simply aren't in the same class as pros. No one should talk about our performances, but we should all be talking about how amazingly fast Shalane, Kara, Galen and Shannon Rowbury crushed the Fifth Avenue Mile (for example).
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\nSorry to get on my high horse and rant, but I am HAPPY CGI dropped their support of the professionals. It's not their job to prop up the sport. Just like it's not the job of shoe companies to keep the sport of track and field alive. If Nike removed all of their money from track and field in the United States, the sport would shrivel up and die. The sport of road racing is in a unique place and it's up to those of us who truly care, as well as USATF, the athletes union, and the rest of the pros, to step up and redefine what the sport is, how it's organized and how it functions as a business. CGI is a sponsor of the sport. They decided it wasn't worth their money. Screw them! Screw Scott Dickey and the rest of their board. They don't understand the SPORT, merely making money on the ACTIVITY, so why should we, the fans of the sport of road racing, care about Rock 'n' Roll races and the rest of the sub-par experiences they throw together around the globe? Our pros don't need them and they deserve something better.
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\nI digress...but what I hope for is that this is a true wake up call for the sport. I hope the sport starts treating itself as such. I hope the sport starts to organize and recognize it shouldn't be lumped into the participatory activity. The men and women who line up at the start of the USA 20km Champs tomorrow morning aren't the same as the 1,000s who trail them, they are different, should be featured as such and the sport should rally around that difference. It's time to feature our sport as a sport, not an activity, or a charity of its own.","date_added":"Sep 1st 2013, 11:21pm","nest":0,"liked":false,"member":[],"can_delete":false,"item_id":172047,"item_type":"news","pb_image":"\/\/www.runnerspace.com\/forum\/uploads\/av-1111.jpg","pb_title":"Scott Bush","pb_url":"profile.php?member_id=1111","pb_url_dns":"https:\/\/Scott-Bush.runnerspace.com\/","pb_wally_id":"624"},"845908":{"pb_id":"42","pb_type":"members","likes":"0","parent_id":"0","pid":"845908","comment_id":"845908","member_id":"42","comment":"

<\/a>Chris Nickinson, on , said:<\/p>

\nThe worst part of the news is that CGI won't be honoring commitments they had made to athletes. For a lack of words, that sucks.
\n
\nThe de-emphasizing of the elites had been a long time coming for their events. Elite fields were shrinking and it wasn't unusual to see the number of true elites at many of their events in the single digits.
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\nI never considered the RnR events (I know they have other series) to be the truly elite events in the US. PRRO and USARC events always have great fields with legitimate prize purses. The big different is they often don't have the appearance moneys or marketing reach of CGI.
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\nWhen I first read the news I had the same reaction as most people but after sleeping on it I can't say that I disagree with their decision and possibly may even agree with it. The RnR, at least as of late, have been all about the recreational jogger and at some of their less established events the elite field almost seems out of place. If the elites aren't the draw for the event they aren't needed there.
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\nI'd like to see the rest of the US elite road scene use this as an opportunity to bulk up their elite fields since there is are fewer options for elites. I take more interest in road races that have 20+ elites in them. The more the better. Even as an elite track athlete I've never been interested in the races that have 6 or so elites.","date_added":"Sep 1st 2013, 8:44am","nest":0,"liked":false,"member":{"wally_id":"84","email_settings":"479","email":"mscherer400@gmail.com","address":"Matt","gender":"m","member_id":"42","member_name":"Matt Scherer","avatar_location":"av-42.png","avatar_type":"upload","avatar":"\/\/www.runnerspace.com\/forum\/uploads\/av-42.png"},"can_delete":false,"item_id":172047,"item_type":"news","pb_image":"\/\/www.runnerspace.com\/forum\/uploads\/av-42.png","pb_title":"Matt Scherer","pb_url":"profile.php?member_id=42","pb_url_dns":"https:\/\/Matt.runnerspace.com\/","pb_wally_id":"84"},"845522":{"pb_id":"9184","pb_type":"members","likes":"0","parent_id":"0","pid":"845522","comment_id":"845522","member_id":"9184","comment":"You know, social media might just have the power to keep this change from sticking. I'm seeing a lot of talk about boycotting CGI events. I hadn't planned on running any myself, but I'll certainly join the boycott in spirit.
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\nThis is a cost-saving move, with the assumption being that non-elite runners will still show up by the thousands if the elites are no longer supported. It's up to us to prove that thinking wrong!
\n
\nHas anyone done up a no-CGI facebook badge yet? Too bad CGI doesn't use a "CGI" logo (they use "competitor group") ... that would be catchy in a red circle with a line through it. People would think it's an anti-FX statement and click through for more info.
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\nDan","date_added":"Sep 1st 2013, 12:09am","nest":0,"liked":false,"member":[],"can_delete":false,"item_id":172047,"item_type":"news","pb_image":"members\/avatar\/3295.jpg","pb_title":"dkap","pb_url":"profile.php?member_id=9184","pb_url_dns":"https:\/\/dkap.runnerspace.com\/","pb_wally_id":"10044"},"845097":{"pb_id":"3026","pb_type":"members","likes":"0","parent_id":"0","pid":"845097","comment_id":"845097","member_id":"3026","comment":"

<\/a>Kevin, on , said:<\/p>

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\n
\n
\n

<\/a>dkap, on , said:<\/p>

<\/div><\/div>
\n
\nThe worst part of the news is that CGI won't be honoring commitments they had made to athletes. For a lack of words, that sucks.
\n
\nThe de-emphasizing of the elites had been a long time coming for their events. Elite fields were shrinking and it wasn't unusual to see the number of true elites at many of their events in the single digits.
\n
\nI never considered the RnR events (I know they have other series) to be the truly elite events in the US. PRRO and USARC events always have great fields with legitimate prize purses. The big different is they often don't have the appearance moneys or marketing reach of CGI.","date_added":"Aug 31st 2013, 6:33pm","nest":0,"liked":false,"member":{"wally_id":"35","email_settings":"7168","email":"chrisnickinson@gmail.com","address":"chrisnickinson","gender":"m","member_id":"3026","member_name":"Chris Nickinson","avatar_location":"av-3026.jpg","avatar_type":"upload","avatar":"\/\/www.runnerspace.com\/forum\/uploads\/av-3026.jpg"},"can_delete":false,"item_id":172047,"item_type":"news","pb_image":"\/\/www.runnerspace.com\/forum\/uploads\/av-3026.jpg","pb_title":"Chris Nickinson","pb_url":"profile.php?member_id=3026","pb_url_dns":"https:\/\/chrisnickinson.runnerspace.com\/","pb_wally_id":"35"},"845084":{"pb_id":"9184","pb_type":"members","likes":"0","parent_id":"0","pid":"845084","comment_id":"845084","member_id":"9184","comment":"For whatever reason, road running doesn't\/can't separate the participatory from the elite. If we could ever figure that out, we'd probably break through all the marketability and sponsorship issues that plague elite runners...
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\nDan","date_added":"Aug 31st 2013, 2:50pm","nest":0,"liked":false,"member":[],"can_delete":false,"item_id":172047,"item_type":"news","pb_image":"members\/avatar\/3295.jpg","pb_title":"dkap","pb_url":"profile.php?member_id=9184","pb_url_dns":"https:\/\/dkap.runnerspace.com\/","pb_wally_id":"10044"},"845075":{"pb_id":"6","pb_type":"members","likes":"0","parent_id":"0","pid":"845075","comment_id":"845075","member_id":"6","comment":"I hear you Dan, and I'm not surprised either, but I don't think it was inevitable. Running not needing elite athletes seems pretty unique to the sport, in fact, I can't think of a single other sport where this is the case. Is there another term for Joe Jogger that applies to another sport? Our major three sports notwithstanding, swimming, golf, soccer, they all have their circuits, stages, and major names. Why does running have such a hard time applying this model?","date_added":"Aug 31st 2013, 12:26pm","nest":0,"liked":false,"member":[],"can_delete":false,"item_id":172047,"item_type":"news","pb_image":"\/\/www.runnerspace.com\/forum\/uploads\/av-6.jpg","pb_title":"Kevin","pb_url":"profile.php?member_id=6","pb_url_dns":"https:\/\/kevin.runnerspace.com\/","pb_wally_id":"25"},"844839":{"pb_id":"9184","pb_type":"members","likes":"0","parent_id":"0","pid":"844839","comment_id":"844839","member_id":"9184","comment":"This doesn't surprise me in the least. It seemed pretty obvious years ago that no good would come from a single entity buying up lots of big races. I can't think of any examples where the "big business" approach hasn't led to cost cutting, and let's be honest, supporting the elite athletes is basically a charity endeavor in the grand scheme of these events. I wouldn't be surprised if this was in the works for a long time and CGI simply needed to hit a critical mass in order to muffle the backlash. The elites can't easily flock to alternative events if there aren't any!
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\nDan","date_added":"Aug 31st 2013, 5:58am","nest":0,"liked":false,"member":[],"can_delete":false,"item_id":172047,"item_type":"news","pb_image":"members\/avatar\/3295.jpg","pb_title":"dkap","pb_url":"profile.php?member_id=9184","pb_url_dns":"https:\/\/dkap.runnerspace.com\/","pb_wally_id":"10044"},"844778":{"pb_id":"4","pb_type":"members","likes":"0","parent_id":"0","pid":"844778","comment_id":"844778","member_id":"4","comment":"This is some really sad news and very bad for the sport.","date_added":"Aug 31st 2013, 3:30am","nest":0,"liked":false,"member":{"wally_id":"31","email_settings":"127","email":"ross@teamxo.com","address":"ross","gender":"m","member_id":"4","member_name":"ross","avatar_location":"av-4.jpg","avatar_type":"upload","avatar":"\/\/www.runnerspace.com\/forum\/uploads\/av-4.jpg"},"can_delete":false,"item_id":172047,"item_type":"news","pb_image":"\/\/www.runnerspace.com\/forum\/uploads\/av-4.jpg","pb_title":"ross","pb_url":"profile.php?member_id=4","pb_url_dns":"https:\/\/ross.runnerspace.com\/","pb_wally_id":"31"}},"last_id":"844778","url":"comments.php?item_type=news&item_id=172047&item_url=gprofile.php?mgroup_id=90"}